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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I thought I add some hopefully useful info to the hive mind

re cam chain wear and auto tensioners

David In Wisconsin put up a pic of new chain

Johnnny Canuck showed us his 50/50 chain

I have one in an engine I have just stripped to check out

where the tensioner is at the end of its travel and the chain

is long overdue for renewal.

below is the good ,not quite so good and the horribly ugly



The bike it came out of has 36 thousand on the clock

and judging by the corrosion I had to overcome to get it apart

Its a fair guess to say this is the first time its been opened up so this is probably the original chain.

I compared it with my spare tensioner and that tensioner has no travel left whatsoever.



 

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Thanks Shep, you did a great thing by this. Now back to getting 'knackered' whilst I watch the Nascar race.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Johnnys doesnt look that bad at all in comparison

Look at the off set of the chain on mine where it leaves the tensioner

for the sprocket

its virtually straight in David and Johnnys pics
 

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I think you are confusing me with Reg




My CX is the one without the,"Air Freshener"


Geeze I guess so!!!! My bad....must be the "knackered" state I'm in! For what it's worth, I always get you two mixed up anyway, regardless my condition.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Ramprat

Quote:

"For what it's worth, I always get you two mixed up anyway"

Oh yeah?

I get it.

Why dont you just come out and say it?



'All you people look the the same to me'



That's it, I'm flouncing off in a huff.......................................













Bloody colonials......





















 

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Ramprat

Quote:

"For what it's worth, I always get you two mixed up anyway"

Oh yeah?

I get it.

Why dont you just come out and say it?



'All you people look the the same to me'



That's it, I'm flouncing off in a huff.......................................













Bloody colonials......























Damn Racial profiling. And I thought it was a mistake that James Earl Jones was the voice of a man in a black rubber suit surrounded by white men.
 

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ROFLMAO!




This place is better than my favorite bar. BYOB though, which is ok by me since my brother and I make our own...



11235813
 

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Reg...so, you've got me to thinking...maybe I needn't bother changing my timing chain after all.



So I went out to the motor and gave the rotor a few twists back a forth. When you twist the rotor clockwise (standing from the rear of the motor) the timing chain tighens up and pushes the sliding tensioner arm in. So much so that you can't even physically push the sliding arm in any further as it's at the beginning point of travel. Conversly when you spin the rotor anti- clockwise, the timing chain slackens off and the tensioner arm pushes out. I was curious as to how far this tensioner actually traveled? So I measured...here are the pics...



The first pic below shows the chain fully straight and tight (after I rotated the engine clockwise). You will notice a small red mark on the travelling arm of the tensioner. I initially tried to use a permanent marker to indicate both ends of travel, but I couldn't get that to work accurately. The measure to the inside tip of the tensioner guide is 13/16th of an inch, sorry I couldn't put my hands on a mm measuring tape.







By the way, that little reference hole in the tensioner sliding arm is not noticeable in this photo, however it is just barely out of view.



After rotating the engine counter clockwise, now the timing chain slackenes off + me pushing the tensioner out as far as I physically could, here's the measurement... 7/8ths of an inch...or exactly 1/16th of an inch of travel, or the equivalent of 1.6 mm of travel.







Also as you can see in this 2nd picture, that about 1/2 of that little hole in the tensioner sliding arm is now noticeable. The little red mark is just to the left hiding behind one of the spring curls. Provided I've measured properly, I would like to think that 1/16 of an inch or 1.6 mm of travel would be acceptable. Is it? What isn't acceptable?



I guess the other question to ask is...how many more Km's of travel would you estimate this chain would deliver before requireing change? I won't hold you or anyone to their answer, just curious.



Again, I do appreciate everyone's comments and suggestions.



Do I really need to change this timing chain?



Johnny
 

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The chain stretches, I'd change it. You may find the adjuster will back off a bit, most of that wear may be from chain stretch and not tensioner wear. Since the tensioners are no longer available for the 650's, a new, tight chain increases it's useful life.
 

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It is your call, Johnny. It looks like your first picture is closer to 5/8" out and the second one 3/4". So that would be about 1/8" difference.



The slack that is presented to the tensioner needs to be measured when the engine has been rotated in the direction of normal travel. From the back side looking forward, I believe that is counterclockwise. When you measure turning the other direction, the slack of the chain is taken up by the tension of turning the camshaft and it's related parts backwards. That is also why when you adjust a manual tensioner, you turn the engine clockwise (from the front nut), to the TL mark. If you go by the mark, and decide to go back, you have to pass the TL mark and then creep back up to it.



I would say you probably have another 10,000 or so miles left on your chain. Is it worth keeping an ear open all the time and the expense of the gaskets to save $60.00 on the chain? I opted to replace the chain on mine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I'd play safe and put a new one in too.

Its just a theory, but I think the auto tensioners are more prone to

fail because of the increased hammering effect they get from a slack chain

where the piston/shaft thingy moves back and forth more and strikes the

retainer ball against the body.



Lets face it, when it comes to new cam chains

most of us wait until we cant stand the noise any longer


I'm not aware of any service interval or mileage limit for cam chains

but now I'm inclined to act as we do on oil changes and

stay well within service limits.

I see Wemoto here in the UK are selling DID cam chains for £30

I'll have one of those.
 

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That's it, I'm flouncing off in a huff.......................................


You'll get more flounce out of your huff if you use a good fabric softener...
 

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Ramprat

Quote:

"For what it's worth, I always get you two mixed up anyway"

Oh yeah?

I get it.

Why dont you just come out and say it?



'All you people look the the same to me'



That's it, I'm flouncing off in a huff.......................................


I can't say that, I have no idea what "look" that is, but you sure do probably all sound the same. Did you have a nice flouncing huff? Share some nips with Shep?
 

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Reg, any chance of any expert tips on flouncing?



You know, the proper hair toss, disdainful expression, flouncing apparrel and the like?


Don't forget the toss of the shoulder at the turn point. Inflection is everything.





Man, have we jacked this thread!
 
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